[The Manhole]

I'd definitely consider Myst as one of the pivotal games of this movement. Despite Myst having 'gameplay', it did class environmental storytelling and atmosphere over it, and indirectly created a swarm of likeminded clones.

Actually, before Cyan made Myst, they created two children's games that were pure notgames: The Manhole and Cosmic Osmo and the Worlds Beyond the Mackerel. Both used the same interaction design as Myst (click to move between static screens, or to interact with things) but they didn't have any goals or puzzles. I loved them when I was a kid.

The Manhole is available in an updated color version in the App Store. It's not as evocative as the black and white original, but at least it's easier than finding an emulator to play the original.

If we're 4-6 people I think we can do it in one group. But if we're more people than that we would definitely have to split up into smaller groups. Personally, I like discussions between more than two as it often leads to ideas bouncing off of each other in unexpected ways.

Maybe it's easiest to do it in August in connection with GDC? Guess people have holidays and stuff during the rest of the summer? Or we could try to get something together before then. I can do second week of July if other people can!

If we do it in July I could bring Mandalarium to talk about. If we do it in August I might have a prototype of another game ready.

A bit. But they didn't want to do another notgames-focused exhibition for fear that they might run out of material too quickly if it turns into an annual event.

A biennale it is then.

But we should probably first define a little bit better among ourselves what we want, when it should happen, how long it would take, how many people would be involved, what we would need in terms of space, food, technology, etc.

I'm thinking along the same lines as Thomas:

- Not too many people
- Everyone has to have a game in progress with problems to discuss
- Enough time for each game to present it, play it properly, and discuss and critique. Maybe 2-3 hours per game
- Any technical stuffs needed to play the games (laptops, consoles, iPads, controllers, etc)

It would probably take at least a full day, if not two.

I would love something like this too. Really enjoyed the discussions we had at the Notgames Fest. Michael, have you talked to them about doing some kind of follow-up this year?

Regarding artifical constraints and music, I think the Dogme films were quite successful in showing that you don't need music to evoke emotions. I was on the edge of my seat throughout The Celebration. Music would have just been in the way.

Play to the strengths of the medium. Make the music part of the game. Make it interactive, responsive. Use sound effects as music, and music as sound effects. Make it random, different every time. Or exclude it completely. Artifical constraints can be liberating.

But yeah, don't just slap a film score on a game.

I adore the art direction. And based on the trailer, it looks like a great experience. But I'm not gonna get a PS3 just to play it.

Flight of the Fireflies was actually structured after The Hero's Journey too. It's not the source material that matters – it's what you do with it.

This got me super excited! I absolutely LOVE the title.

I love the talk. And not just for the game design and programming part. His general approach to design and life resonates deeply with me. It's just how I approach games. It comes from the same indignation. That there aren't more artistic games isn't an opportunity – it's an outrage. It's morally wrong. And that's actually a very healthy place to come from when designing something. It focuses what you're trying to do.

Also, if you're interested in interaction design (I am, since it's my day job), his essay Magic Ink is good reading too. It details another point he mentions in the talk, that good interaction design is about visualization and comparison.

The word "notgames" has grown on me. I've started saying in Swedish that I create "ospel". It has the same weird ring to it. Gets people interested.

I like it. The art is not just interactive, meaning the audience can interact with the artwork, but don't have to. The art is active, meaning the audience has to actively participate – otherwise they can't experience the artwork. Also, it has novelty, and compares well to other terms like "performance art". But I don't think it would work outside of an art context. Saying that a game is "active art" on the App Store or Steam would just marginalize it.

Hear hear. I wish there was some easy way of adding dirt, dust, scratches and imperfections procedurally. Particles perhaps?

You could try giving the achievements inscrutable names. Instead of getting "Planet X: Found Planet X" you get "Hole in the sky: Experienced the unknowable". That way the player can't just look at the list of achievements and use it as a to do list. Keeps some of the mystery.

In some ways, I think LARPs have come a lot farther than video games. I've never been to a LARP myself, but based on what I've heard from friends, there's a quite vibrant community around LARPs as art form here in the Nordics. There's LARPs that explore all sorts of things: destructive personal relationships, the threat of AIDS in the 80's gay community, what it must be like to be a cat, the relationship between the role you play and your normal self, etc. One LARP that I heard of was basically a two-day reenactment of the Dogme movie "Festen" –– without an audience.

Your friend sounds very wise.

I think points are – if you'll forgive the pun – pointless. In most games they serve no real purpose. Either the experience is worth having without points, in which case the points aren't needed. Or the only way to make the experience engaging is to add points, in which case the game isn't needed. I get tricked into playing games just to collect points from time to time – I think everybody does. All it ever does is leave me with the stale taste of wasted time in my mouth.